+ Item Drop % Needed to Guarantee a Drop
 Turtle Juice
 Inscrutable Pi
 Posts: 222
 Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2009 1:58 pm
 Location: Frozen Northlands
+ Item Drop % Needed to Guarantee a Drop
I run into this problem with every run (partially because my math skills are limited)  but I'm constantly asking in chat what + item drop percent I need to guarantee an item to drop, and I thought it would be great to have a little guide to refer to.
So, here is a list of what I'm trying to find the + item percent needed to guarantee a drop, feel free to add items and please either add the + percent needed, or let me know what the formula is and I can use my calculating device to figure it out.
Main items needed
Okay  I added in the % needed to guarantee a drop, but rounded (so if it is 18% I rounded up to 20%, etc.)
Sonarinabiscuit (crazy range here) 18.6%  30.2% range
+ 400% (crazy) ... 233.33% needed at + 30% drop rate
White pixel (from Blooper) 60, 70, & 80%  so assume 60% drop rate for all 3
+ 66.66%
Tattered scrap of paper 29.9% drop rate
+ 233.33%
disintegrating quill pen 21.2% drop rate
+ 400%
inkwell 30% drop rate
+ 233.33%
Glass of goat's milk 20.4% drop rate
+ 400%
Goat cheese 39.2% drop rate
+ 150%
Drum machine 29.5% drop rate
+ 233.33%
Tomb ratchet 20% drop rate
+ 400%
Heavy D 39.3% drop rate
+ 150%
soft green echo eyedrop antidote 21.2% (Random encounter) 30.8% (Quiet healer)
+ 400% (low end) and 233.33% (high end)
Ruby W, Metallic A, Lowercase n 30% drop rate
+ 233.33%
Sunken eyes & broken wings 50% drop rate
+ 100% (why can't they all be this easy?)
Stunt nuts 31.9% & 29.3% drop rate
+ 233.33%
Thin black candle 29.2% drop rate
+ 233.33%
Ketchup hound 36.3% drop rate
+ 185.71%
Rigging shampoo, ball polish, mizzenmast mop 30% drop rate
+ 233.33%
Dusty bottle 19%  21.1% drop rate
+ 400%
Here are others for tower, HC needs, backfarming, etc.:
Stars / lines 22.6%  40% range
+ 400% to 150%
Knob Goblin harem pants 3.7%
too low to calculate (like + 2,600%)
Knob Goblin harem veil 4.4%
+ a ton that of gear and potions you don't have
Knob Goblin perfume 14.7%
+ 566.66%
Hellion cube 29.7%
+ 400%
Giant needle 28.4%
+ 400%
Furry fur 37.4%
+ 185.71% (rounded down)
Awful poetry journal 29%
+ 233.33%
bird rib and lion oil 20%
+ 400%
wussiness potion 30%
+ 233.33%
pygmy blowgun 30%
+ 233.33%
pygmy pygment 25.4%
+ 300%
jungle drum 10.1%
+ 900%
canopic jar 30%
+ 233.33%
bronzed locust 19.3%
+ 400%
More to come.
Maybe the easiest thing to help would be a simple list of percent drop by 10s with % modifier needed to get it to 100.
Any other thoughts would be helpful.
Thanks.
TJ
So, here is a list of what I'm trying to find the + item percent needed to guarantee a drop, feel free to add items and please either add the + percent needed, or let me know what the formula is and I can use my calculating device to figure it out.
Main items needed
Okay  I added in the % needed to guarantee a drop, but rounded (so if it is 18% I rounded up to 20%, etc.)
Sonarinabiscuit (crazy range here) 18.6%  30.2% range
+ 400% (crazy) ... 233.33% needed at + 30% drop rate
White pixel (from Blooper) 60, 70, & 80%  so assume 60% drop rate for all 3
+ 66.66%
Tattered scrap of paper 29.9% drop rate
+ 233.33%
disintegrating quill pen 21.2% drop rate
+ 400%
inkwell 30% drop rate
+ 233.33%
Glass of goat's milk 20.4% drop rate
+ 400%
Goat cheese 39.2% drop rate
+ 150%
Drum machine 29.5% drop rate
+ 233.33%
Tomb ratchet 20% drop rate
+ 400%
Heavy D 39.3% drop rate
+ 150%
soft green echo eyedrop antidote 21.2% (Random encounter) 30.8% (Quiet healer)
+ 400% (low end) and 233.33% (high end)
Ruby W, Metallic A, Lowercase n 30% drop rate
+ 233.33%
Sunken eyes & broken wings 50% drop rate
+ 100% (why can't they all be this easy?)
Stunt nuts 31.9% & 29.3% drop rate
+ 233.33%
Thin black candle 29.2% drop rate
+ 233.33%
Ketchup hound 36.3% drop rate
+ 185.71%
Rigging shampoo, ball polish, mizzenmast mop 30% drop rate
+ 233.33%
Dusty bottle 19%  21.1% drop rate
+ 400%
Here are others for tower, HC needs, backfarming, etc.:
Stars / lines 22.6%  40% range
+ 400% to 150%
Knob Goblin harem pants 3.7%
too low to calculate (like + 2,600%)
Knob Goblin harem veil 4.4%
+ a ton that of gear and potions you don't have
Knob Goblin perfume 14.7%
+ 566.66%
Hellion cube 29.7%
+ 400%
Giant needle 28.4%
+ 400%
Furry fur 37.4%
+ 185.71% (rounded down)
Awful poetry journal 29%
+ 233.33%
bird rib and lion oil 20%
+ 400%
wussiness potion 30%
+ 233.33%
pygmy blowgun 30%
+ 233.33%
pygmy pygment 25.4%
+ 300%
jungle drum 10.1%
+ 900%
canopic jar 30%
+ 233.33%
bronzed locust 19.3%
+ 400%
More to come.
Maybe the easiest thing to help would be a simple list of percent drop by 10s with % modifier needed to get it to 100.
Any other thoughts would be helpful.
Thanks.
TJ
Last edited by Turtle Juice on Tue Jul 20, 2010 3:20 pm, edited 3 times in total.
 NardoLoopa
 Market Manipulator
 Posts: 1201
 Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2007 10:37 pm
Re: + Item Drop % Needed to Guarantee a Drop
I could be wrong, but I believe Mafia tells you what your adjusted droprate is in the Locations panel for whatever your "+drops" is at the time.
The adjusted droprate is: base_drop*(1+bonus/ 100)
The adjusted droprate is: base_drop*(1+bonus/ 100)
 stupac2
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Re: + Item Drop % Needed to Guarantee a Drop
If you know the base rate calculating what you need is pretty straightforward. It's just (100/rate  1)*100
So for tomb ratchets, which are a 20% rate, you need 400% items (100/20 = 5, 51 = 4, 4*100 = 400). In a case like the bats where it's variable across monsters, calculate based on the lowest (not that it matters there, since you're not going to max out a 30% rate that early in a run anyway).
Also, as nardo says mafia tells you the modified rates in the Location Details dropdown on the main tab. Very useful for those times you're not sure what the rate is.
So for tomb ratchets, which are a 20% rate, you need 400% items (100/20 = 5, 51 = 4, 4*100 = 400). In a case like the bats where it's variable across monsters, calculate based on the lowest (not that it matters there, since you're not going to max out a 30% rate that early in a run anyway).
Also, as nardo says mafia tells you the modified rates in the Location Details dropdown on the main tab. Very useful for those times you're not sure what the rate is.
 maddsurgeon
 Fie the Pie
 Posts: 800
 Joined: Sun Sep 27, 2009 10:24 am
 Contact:
Re: + Item Drop % Needed to Guarantee a Drop
Perhaps the best format for this information would be a spreadsheet that runs all the relevant items through the formula?
It would be a oneglance thing where you'd just need to plug in your item rate, and would obviate the need to calculate each time.
It would be a oneglance thing where you'd just need to plug in your item rate, and would obviate the need to calculate each time.
 Turtle Juice
 Inscrutable Pi
 Posts: 222
 Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2009 1:58 pm
 Location: Frozen Northlands
Re: + Item Drop % Needed to Guarantee a Drop
Okay, so following that sweet formula  here are the drop rates % needed to ensure drops in increments of 5%:
5% rate, you need +1,900%
10% rate, you need +900%
15% rate, you need +566.66%
20% rate, you need +400%
25% rate, you need +300%
30% rate, you need +233.33%
35% rate, you need +185.71%0
40% rate, you need +150%
45% rate, you need +122.22%
50% rate, you need +100%
55% rate, you need +81.81%
60% rate, you need +66.66%
65% rate, you need +53.84%
70% rate, you need +42.85%
75% rate, you need +33.33%
80% rate, you need +25%
85% rate, you need +17.64%
90% rate, you need +11.11%
95% rate, you need +5.26%
100% rate, you need +0!
And I like having a little cheat sheet rather than going to mafia and adding + items until it gets up to 100  but that's just me.
5% rate, you need +1,900%
10% rate, you need +900%
15% rate, you need +566.66%
20% rate, you need +400%
25% rate, you need +300%
30% rate, you need +233.33%
35% rate, you need +185.71%0
40% rate, you need +150%
45% rate, you need +122.22%
50% rate, you need +100%
55% rate, you need +81.81%
60% rate, you need +66.66%
65% rate, you need +53.84%
70% rate, you need +42.85%
75% rate, you need +33.33%
80% rate, you need +25%
85% rate, you need +17.64%
90% rate, you need +11.11%
95% rate, you need +5.26%
100% rate, you need +0!
And I like having a little cheat sheet rather than going to mafia and adding + items until it gets up to 100  but that's just me.
Re: + Item Drop % Needed to Guarantee a Drop
Sweet cheat sheet!
Could you perhaps highlight the items that cannot be yellow rayed? Cos those are the ones that really get on my nerves
Could you perhaps highlight the items that cannot be yellow rayed? Cos those are the ones that really get on my nerves
grrrrrrr

 Spy vs. Pie
 Posts: 50
 Joined: Sat Mar 13, 2010 1:35 am
Re: + Item Drop % Needed to Guarantee a Drop
You've got goat cheese down as needing 185% to assure the drop, you only need 150% however to assure the drop
 Turtle Juice
 Inscrutable Pi
 Posts: 222
 Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2009 1:58 pm
 Location: Frozen Northlands
Re: + Item Drop % Needed to Guarantee a Drop
Ooops, fixed Goat Cheese ...
39.2% drop rate ... 155.10% + items to guarantee 100% drop.
100/39.2 = 2.55  1 = 1.55 x 100 = 155.10
39.2% drop rate ... 155.10% + items to guarantee 100% drop.
100/39.2 = 2.55  1 = 1.55 x 100 = 155.10
 stupac2
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Re: + Item Drop % Needed to Guarantee a Drop
39.2 = 40.
 Turtle Juice
 Inscrutable Pi
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 Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2009 1:58 pm
 Location: Frozen Northlands
Re: + Item Drop % Needed to Guarantee a Drop
Geez, I feel like I'm in 6th grade math again ... 150% it is.
 stupac2
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Re: + Item Drop % Needed to Guarantee a Drop
One of the greatest things about the KoLverse is that we can talk to its god and he likes multiples of 5. Jick would never code a 39.2% drop rate (and not to mention that if he did it would have to be a conditional, and so couldn't be PPed, but sonars can, etc).Turtle Juice wrote:Geez, I feel like I'm in 6th grade math again ... 150% it is.
Re: + Item Drop % Needed to Guarantee a Drop
This implies that most of the drop rates on the wiki are incorrect, since they are not round multiples of 5.
I usually get around this by just mentally rounding down to the nearest multiple of 5 and calculating +item needed from there.
I usually get around this by just mentally rounding down to the nearest multiple of 5 and calculating +item needed from there.
Re: + Item Drop % Needed to Guarantee a Drop
IIRC, most if not all of the drop rates are taken from Yiab's spading, who posts the exact values he gets from the massive amount of trials he runs through, not caring about rounding. Hence the odd values you'll get in the wiki, and not really 'incorrect'.Kelemvor wrote:This implies that most of the drop rates on the wiki are incorrect, since they are not round multiples of 5.
Also, a relevant note for those who don't notice it already: The sweet spot for 'readily available' +item is 233.33%. Why is this? Because a TON of important items have a 30% drop rate: tattered scraps, skullbat sonars, all of the important castle items, soft greens from healers, nearly all of the valley scrolls, f'c'le items, black no2/adder bladder/other gate items, drum machine, stars/lines... the list keeps going on. Anything at 35% is rare (only hound/stew items IIRC) and 40% is easy enough anyway.
As an aside, I don't think any items actually exist in the game that have 25% drop rate. O_o
 lostcalpolydude
 Forum Maestro
 Posts: 2940
 Joined: Wed Apr 23, 2008 6:54 pm
Re: + Item Drop % Needed to Guarantee a Drop
Mafia data files make this trivial to check.NotJim wrote:As an aside, I don't think any items actually exist in the game that have 25% drop rate. O_o
http://kol.coldfront.net/thekolwiki/ind ... ahogany%29
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