One Crazy Random Summer leaderboard strategizing

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ungawa
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One Crazy Random Summer leaderboard strategizing

Post by ungawa » Tue Jun 23, 2015 8:09 am

I'm not sure how interested folks are in trying to leaderboard for this path, but with yojimbos theory on "Fun" and my most recent ascension shedding some more light, I wanted to start a discussion on maximizing "Fun".
I just finished a 15/144 SC run that scored 3692 "Fun". Having a low turncount run score that highly seems to be a strong indication that turncount is the most likely denominator of the "Average number of Modifiers" term in yojimbos theory. ("Fun" = RAND(0.5,1)*(1000+100*"Average number of Modifiers")

From there, the apparent SC strategy seems to be to start a run today that will continue until the end of the season and minimize turncount while maximizing free combats with 9 modifiers. Also, even though yojimbos theory is public and it won't be hard for an outsider to draw conclusions from the info in my ascension history, I'd prefer to keep the below strategy in-clan, at least until any clannies interested in trying to turtlecore their way up the leaderboard have a head start on the competition.

Numbers: My run saw around 5499 modifiers, which is an average of 38.2 modifiers seen/turn. If the monster has to be defeated, take away 800 modifiers from Louder than Bomb free runs and a handful of beaten ups, and get an average of 32.6 modifiers defeated/turn. Using those averages, according to the theory my RAND term was 0.76 or 0.87, respectively.


Maximize free combats:
Ascend Seal Clubber and pull the Claw of the Infernal Seal for 10 seal fights per day
Pull lots of power pills for 20 free combats per day
Use up to 11 bowls of scorpions per day on drunk pygmies. Possibly paint a drunk pygmy in-run for a 12th free pygmy. (I haven't confirmed the bowl of scorpions works outside of the bowling alley)
Use up to 3 lynyrd snares per day for free combats
Use up to 5 glark cables per day for free combats in the zeppelin

Under this theory, Optimal monsters are free "Fun". However, Cleeshed monsters have some flag that prevents power pills from working on them, so we can't cleesh to reroll for Optimal if we're trying to use the pill. We can cleesh to try to reroll optimal when we have spare Louder than Bombs, but I'd be a little worried about that since in this path I've seen cleeshed monsters keel over without taking any damage.

Can anyone think of other ways to increase total modifiers in the numerator without increasing turncount in the denominator? I guess we still don't know if we have to defeat a monster or just see it for its modifiers to count.


As far as HC strategy goes, I'm not sure what is optimal. I expect you'd also want to do a turtlecore run as a Seal Clubber to minimize turncount and get free seal fights. However, that is few enough kills per day, you probably wouldn't expect m/any power pills, so I'm not sure how effective a HC turtlecore run would be in the remaining time until the season ends August 14th.

Also, just a note, but I submitted a report of my past run. I don't think it counts as abuse, but I wanted to make sure TPTB were aware of this somewhat degenerate run. I'm personally looking forward to a 52 day turtlecore run and it'll be a nice mini-hiatus from speed ascending, but I'd also understand if they felt they had to change something.

redfoxtail
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Re: One Crazy Random Summer leaderboard strategizing

Post by redfoxtail » Tue Jun 23, 2015 3:16 pm

I don't have any bright ideas to add right now, but (a) thank you for all this! and (b) 15/144 is just a delightfully insane day/turncount.

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lostcalpolydude
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Re: One Crazy Random Summer leaderboard strategizing

Post by lostcalpolydude » Tue Jun 23, 2015 11:35 pm

ungawa wrote:Also, just a note, but I submitted a report of my past run. I don't think it counts as abuse, but I wanted to make sure TPTB were aware of this somewhat degenerate run. I'm personally looking forward to a 52 day turtlecore run and it'll be a nice mini-hiatus from speed ascending, but I'd also understand if they felt they had to change something.
And since not everyone would have seen me mention it in chat, Jick has no problem with how the run was done.
bmaher: Softcore character
lostcalpolydude: Hardcore character (abandoned)

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ungawa
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Re: One Crazy Random Summer leaderboard strategizing

Post by ungawa » Thu Jun 25, 2015 8:38 am

Good news for SC! Free runs post ronin don't give free fun, so we don't have to worry about breaking ronin and buying all the tatters in the mall.
From my spading run, I can't tell whether:
1) Free runs NEVER give free fun
or
2) Free runs ONLY don't give free fun post ronin

If I had to guess, I'd guess free runs never give free fun.

Numbers:
842 modifiers while breaking ronin
11,190 modifiers seen post ronin while free running (a combination of short writs, T.U.R.D.S., indigo taffy, and tatters)
1007 turncount

If free runs count, expected fun is 1097-2195
If free runs don't count, expected fun is 541-1084

The run ended up scoring 891 fun

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lostcalpolydude
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Re: One Crazy Random Summer leaderboard strategizing

Post by lostcalpolydude » Thu Jun 25, 2015 8:48 am

So you need to spam power pills instead of tattered scraps post-ronin?
bmaher: Softcore character
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ungawa
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Re: One Crazy Random Summer leaderboard strategizing

Post by ungawa » Thu Jun 25, 2015 8:51 am

But there's a limit of using 20 power pills per day, and you can pull that many, so might as well go for a low turncount while you're at it. But yes, SC gold will likely require 20 power pills a day.

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ungawa
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Re: One Crazy Random Summer leaderboard strategizing

Post by ungawa » Thu Jun 25, 2015 7:12 pm

Oh... *shudder* I just had a terrible idea.
Step 1: Break ronin
Step 2: Tatter from everything not Optimal
Step 3: Kill everything Optimal
.....
Receive Fun limited only by tatters in the mall and meat?

Even I'm not crazy enough to try this, but oh my.
I guess the occasional blocking + ticking/electrical combo beating you up might make it hard to actually make much progress if you're only killing Optimals. (Not to mention that we don't actually know if Fun can increase post-Ronin.)

yojimbos_law
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Re: One Crazy Random Summer leaderboard strategizing

Post by yojimbos_law » Sat Jun 27, 2015 10:03 pm

Do we know whether optimal monsters are counted?

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ungawa
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Re: One Crazy Random Summer leaderboard strategizing

Post by ungawa » Sun Jun 28, 2015 7:49 am

None of my runs can answer that question. Gun to my head, I'd guess they do count.

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Re: One Crazy Random Summer leaderboard strategizing

Post by yojimbos_law » Fri Jul 03, 2015 1:41 am

For what it's worth, indigo taffy can be used in the sea with fishy (obtained from a pull in SC or 1 turn in the old man's psychoses in HC) for a bunch of rerolls for optimal monsters. Furthermore, yellow and red taffies can be used on optimal monsters in the sea for neat items. I don't think this really has any applications besides getting like 5-10 extra optimal monsters per run.

Also, copperhead takes fewer turns to complete than the pirates in HC (14 vs. 16 not including optimal monsters). The glark cables are also good for getting your second power pill.

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Re: One Crazy Random Summer leaderboard strategizing

Post by blisterguy » Fri Jul 03, 2015 2:00 am

ungawa wrote:Maximize free combats:
Ascend Seal Clubber and pull the Claw of the Infernal Seal for 10 seal fights per day
Pull lots of power pills for 20 free combats per day
Use up to 11 bowls of scorpions per day on drunk pygmies. Possibly paint a drunk pygmy in-run for a 12th free pygmy. (I haven't confirmed the bowl of scorpions works outside of the bowling alley)
Use up to 3 lynyrd snares per day for free combats
Use up to 5 glark cables per day for free combats in the zeppelin
Forgive my old man naivety, but if you're pull any glark cables, for example, that's reducing the number of power pills you're pulling, right? Are you running Puck Man almost all of the time to get more power pills too?

Disclosure: I could never dedicate the time needed to surpass SC Gold, but I'm figuring I may as well turtle myself up a Silver.

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ungawa
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Re: One Crazy Random Summer leaderboard strategizing

Post by ungawa » Fri Jul 03, 2015 7:33 pm

That's why I plan to farm the cables rather than pull them.
My plan on paper is pull 17 power pills and 3 lynyrd snares per day, and I'll get the other 3 power pills to drop most days in my 49ish free combats. (I'll fit in assorted quest pulls after days I have to rollover runaway from something that's about to kill me, resulting in carried over unused power pills meaning I don't have to pull as many that day.)
I'll start each day on the trail of either a red butler or drunk pygmy, and do the corresponding zone first until hit the daily limit (5 cables used or 11 drunk pygmies). Then I'll use my daily SGEEA from the gameinform to remove on the trail. Then I'll sniff the the monster for the other zone from a copy (chateau painting of a drunk pygmy after closeting bowls of scorpions, daily ice sculpture of a butler), and do the other zone. With 20 power pills and 6 LTB, I don't see any trouble getting through all those limited free combats daily once I'm done questing. While I'm still working on a majority of the council quests, I'll have to balance spending pills hunting those free fights and progressing on quests.
I just got through the mob of protesters today, so I'll start adding the butlers, so soon I'll have a better idea how that works in practice.

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Re: One Crazy Random Summer leaderboard strategizing

Post by blisterguy » Sun Jul 05, 2015 5:45 pm

That's so awesome. I'm glad you're going for Gold so I don't have to worry to that level of optimisation.
:D

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ungawa
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Re: One Crazy Random Summer leaderboard strategizing

Post by ungawa » Mon Jul 06, 2015 10:11 am

Bah, flaming wreckage on the Zeppelin after defeating Ron is a hassle. Got +1 turncount from a fragile jittery mob that got hit and killed by wreckage before I could act. I'm going to try upping ML to give them more health, but yojimbo points out frozen ones will take double damage from the wreckage. So far I've seen up to 78 damage from the wreckage, so I'm going for at least 160ML in the Zeppelin. I don't need to stagger, so +ML doesn't seem like it'll be too big a problem, but we'll see how this goes. Maybe I would have been better off using LTB any time I found Ron for another month or so.
Other than that, the plan to farm cables is working well. I've been getting through daily bowling alley and zeppelin free fights fast enough to use 10+ power pills on quest progression.

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