QuantumNightmare wrote:I tested stat days in january 2008, and added the fact that it rounds up to the wiki at the time. So this was in NS13, after that trivial announcement.

Ah, I see it now on the stat days page. I'd looked at the stat gains page, which is actually a redirect to just stat gains from fights. Still, it does look like only combat gains are ceiled (yay new words, I hated typing ceiling'd) so far, though we still need to check a number of other things I guess, like consumables, the gym, etc.

QuantumNightmare wrote:As for stat rounding occuring after adding together all stats are added together +ML leads to an easy test, and I had assumed familiars functioned in the same way. If you have +15ML, you get 3-4 stats (+3.75). If you have a 20 pound volleyball instead, you get 4-5 stats (+4.47). If you combine the two, you get 8-9 stats (+8.22) instead of (3 to 4) + (4 to 5) = (7 to 9).

I'm pretty certain this at least used to not be the case; for instance, for a while the volley gain formulas were floored, but this didn't affect fractional ML gains' rounding. Also, to my knowledge sombrero gains are still floored. Have you spaded the above case to see whether the range is 8-9 or 7-9? (Or easier, fight bunnies with +5ML for a 1.5 gain with a 20lb (or 30lb) volley. If they're added before rounding, you'll almost always see 6 total (7 for a 30 volley), with the rare 5 (or 6). If they're rounded before adding, you should see 5, 6, 7 (or 6, 7, 8 ) commonly, seeing the middle value about half the time and the other two around 25% each.)

EDIT: Ran the bunnies at +5 ML with a 20lb volley myself. Got 5, 6, 6, 7 substats, when accounting for the ceiled moxie stat day. So, looks like they (MS and FS in flolle's formula) are rounded separately before being added together. Is there any way to get non-whole number bonus stats, to see if those are rounded separately as well?

QuantumNightmare wrote:Back to salien - are we sure thet donating 200 meat gives exactly 1.00 substats? If it gives anywhere from 0.01 to 2.4 substats, ceiling(1.25*statgain) would give a range of 1 to 3.

I haven't tested this personally, but the wiki currently states that for each 200 meat you spend, you get exactly either 1 or 2 substats, 50% chance of each. Long ago, it would actually just roll a single die based on the entire amount you donated, with a range of (donation/200) to (donation/100), all with equal probabilities. That was changed to give a more normalized distribution, because people were forcing it anyway by donating 200 at a time over and over, but I'm pretty certain the average amount per 200 hasn't changed; I know that at least the average gain for a donation of 200 is 1.5, and that I've never gotten more than 2 stats for donation of 200 on a non-stat day, so I can't really see any way the range could be anything other than 1-2 (if it went higher than 2, you'd see 3s on non-stat days, and if it can't go higher than 2, it can't go lower than 1 and have an average of 1.5), and I don't see any reason to suppose it is a continuous range rather than a discrete 1 or 2.

Flolle wrote:Or maybe I just mixed something up, because I ran another 50 turns and noticed that you always get one substat from bunnies if you don't run any -Stats effects. You even get that substat point with +Stats effects running. No idea whether this is known or not, but it sure is strange behaviour.

I think it's just that the part of the formula that takes ML/4 as stats has a min of 1; I had bunnies hit me with no DA and 1 moxie to confirm they don't do more than 1 damage. Then I hit them with the drowsy sword (-10ML) and still got 1 stat per combat. Then I removed the sword and kept upping the MCD by 1, and at 4 I started getting 2 substats sometimes (accounting for the stat day). So, that confirms that bunnies are 1 ML, and that even at -ML you still get at least 1 substat from the monster. (For extra fun, I threw on the rat mask and drowsy sword for -15ML, and hit bat hole entryway monsters (12-14ML) and confirmed I still got exactly one substat from them each time.)

One extra thing I checked: -stats does NOT effect 'hard' stats. Hit bunnies with peeled eyes and nothing else, no stats. Hit them with peeled eyes and wasabi sinuses, still no stats. Added a witty rapier, and got 2 myst stats every time (if -stats could affect hard stats, I would've expected only 1 myst substat). Let peeled eyes wear off (so just witty and wasabi), still 2 myst stats every time. (This is similar to what flolle posted, but flolle didn't specifically state testing with -stats greater than expected variable stats, so I wanted to be certain).