The Slime Tube

This is where you spade, shovel and sickle. Or is it reap?
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Eleron
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The Slime Tube

Post by Eleron » Mon Jun 01, 2009 6:37 pm

Here's a fairly representative description of how the slime tube works, thanks to all clannies for helping out =)

The slime tube consists of 9 levels + a boss. Each level takes 111 turns and the boss takes 1, for a total of 1000 turns.

At the beginning of fights, if you're not already slimed, you will be coated in slime for X turns, where X is normally 10 for weak slimes but is decreased by 1 turn for every +100 ML you add. Once you have the effect, the number of turns remaining decreases by 1 per turn just like normal effects. As the number remaining decreases, the slime starts to hurt at lot, damaging you with slime damage at the beginning of each fight. Slime damage works like other elements, except you need the unique "slime resistance" to resist it, and resistance is required to survive at low turn counts.

At the start of every fight (even outside the tube), you take slime damage proportional to your max HP:

10 turns: 0%
9 turns: 6.7%
8 turns: 20.1%
7 turns: 43.9%
6 turns: 80.6%
5 turns: 132.5%
4 turns: 201.7%
3 turns: 290.3%
2 turns: 400.2%
1 turns: 533.4%

This means that when there's 5 turns of less remaining, you will be immediately beaten up at the start of combat unless you have slime resistance. The slimes themselves are pretty weak, and the only major concern is being coated in slime. Luckily it's possible to use chamois to remove the slime coating, in which case it will start over from X when you fight a new enemy.

The trick about the slime tube is that you can speed it up by running +ML. Approximately +400 ML makes each combat count as one additional turn, and fractional values count as well. This means that if everyone is running e.g. +234 ML, then the dive will take close to 999/(1+234/400)+1 = 632 turns.

There's also a noncombat in the slime tube, which lets you choose to either to tickle the uvula (which lets you turn rusty items into slime-covered items that help in the tube), or squeeze the gall bladder. By squeezing the gall bladder you increase the ambient tube ML by +20, which can be done once per person up to a total of +100. If people run +234 ML and start by using runaways until 5 bladders have been squeezed, you would get 999/(1+334/400)+1+5 = 551 turns, which is pretty speedy.

The slime monsters you see in the tube depend on your effective ML, and have different item drops, but are quite easy to kill apart from the slime-coating-attack. The slimes come in 5 different varieties, where the first is for ML <= 100, the second from 101-300 ML, the third from 301 to presumably 600 ML, fourth from 601-1000 and fifth at 1001+. For current speedful runs, the third form is what you're most likely to see, which gets run turncounts in the 575-400 region (that's about where shirts have been found).

The boss itself drops a skill item and an outfit item, + a number of nice spleen items that give +ML and slime resist (amount dropped scales with +item%) for speed runs, and special speed items for breaking certain turncount goals.

The boss has about 3000 HP, and has a special ability where it gets immunity to an element after it has taken about 500 damage from it. This means that once you've e.g. done >500 physical damage in the fight, all further physical damage will be reduced to 1. The trick to beating the boss is to be able to do many types of damage, preferably on demand, which the hobo skills are really good for.

(A common tactic using hobo skills is to do around 450 damage with the first cast, and then 450+450 in the following round. In this case the boss won't gain immunity until after the second round and it has taken 1350 damage total from that element, so you just need 3 spells instead of 6 damage sources.)
Last edited by Eleron on Wed Jun 03, 2009 4:37 am, edited 9 times in total.

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Post by preniqueezer » Mon Jun 01, 2009 7:24 pm

Fantastic rundown, Eleron. You just gave most of what I wanted to know about the tube. Not sure if a description of how beating Mother Slime should be added, since that's less intuitive?

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Fred Nefler
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Post by Fred Nefler » Mon Jun 01, 2009 8:56 pm

Initial data suggests you get one alveoli for every +50% item drops you have, provided your turncount is low enough (looks like 700 or less; we've gotten them to drop on turncounts of 688 and 691). I presume there is a minimum of one that drops. We've seen 12 alveoli at bit over +600%, and 14 at a bit over +700%. The chamoisole seems to be about 580 and less to get.

And I would think that the way the game measures progress is not in "turns", but in total ML. In which case determining the base ML of the tier 1 slimes would be pertinent.

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Post by stupac2 » Mon Jun 01, 2009 9:06 pm

Fred Nefler wrote:And I would think that the way the game measures progress is not in "turns", but in total ML. In which case determining the base ML of the tier 1 slimes would be pertinent.
Isn't that basically trivial with the dwarf gear?

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Post by Suendenbock » Mon Jun 01, 2009 9:23 pm

Thank you for the overview!

I was planning of jumping into the tube as soon as i have finished this run. And with this post i feel like i already am a Slime-covered Veteran.

Also Shouldnt this be added to seperate section maybe switching the Hobopolis part of the Forum to a "Clan Dungeon" part, so all these posts would have a new home and also represent the trend that Jick has set with the Leadeboards. Just a little thought of mine

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Post by Eleron » Tue Jun 02, 2009 12:18 am

Fred Nefler wrote:And I would think that the way the game measures progress is not in "turns", but in total ML.
Progress caused by the base slime itself doesn't seem to be proportional to the slime level in a normal ML fashion, no.
"Slimey points" might be more accurate than turns though, sure :)

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Re: The Slime Tube

Post by Ceirdwyn » Tue Jun 02, 2009 2:06 am

Eleron wrote: At the start of every fight (even outside the tube), you take slime damage proportional to your max HP:

10 turns: 0%
9 turns: 6.7%
8 turns: 20.1%
7 turns: 43.9%
6 turns: 80.6%
5 turns: 132.5%
4 turns: 201.7%
3 turns: 290.3%
2 turns: 400.2%
1 turns: 533.4%
Note: It is also possible getting 11 turns of the effect when running absolutely no ML. Then you won't take damage for the first 2 combats.

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Post by Spiny_Twizzler » Tue Jun 02, 2009 6:27 am

This thread is awesome :) Thanks for all the hard work!

-Spiny

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Re: The Slime Tube

Post by Atrophied » Tue Jun 02, 2009 9:24 pm

Eleron wrote:
At the start of every fight (even outside the tube), you take slime damage proportional to your max HP:

10 turns: 0%
9 turns: 6.7%
8 turns: 20.1%
7 turns: 43.9%
6 turns: 80.6%
5 turns: 132.5%
4 turns: 201.7%
3 turns: 290.3%
2 turns: 400.2%
1 turns: 533.4%
After more testing, and starting at 11 turns of Slimed, 10 turns remaining damages you for a consistent 1% of your Max HP. This doesn't come into effect when given 10 turns, but only when given 11 and starting a new combat with 10 remaining. (Or, presumably, being given 10 rounds, tattering away and starting a new combat.)

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Post by salien » Fri Jun 05, 2009 3:35 pm

Thanks for all the info here, it was very helpful in procuring our first caustic slime nodule. :) I am, however, fairly certain that the 999 in the turncount formula should be 1000. That's perfectly consistent with the run I just completed, and also makes more sense with the initial "1000 monsters, 1 boss" description.

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Post by charred » Sat Jun 06, 2009 12:44 am

i ended up getting a chamoisole to drop last night on our 663 slime tube run... had over 450% items

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Post by Eleron » Sat Jun 06, 2009 2:52 am

We think the cut-off point might be 690 for the cham, just like the alveoli, but that you need luck as well. That's pure speculation though :)

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Fred Nefler
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Post by Fred Nefler » Tue Jun 09, 2009 5:28 am

A 538 run I did at a fixed ML indicates it should be a 1000 in your turncount formula, not a 999.

Or, another way of casting it that I saw someone use in the forums, the number of kills you need is:
400,000/(400 + ML)
Which is just your formula (with 1000 instead of 999) multiplied on the top and bottom by 400. So it could be that there are 400k "slimy points" in some sense, with each monster being a base of 400 points, and each point of ML giving an extra point.

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Post by NotJim » Thu Jul 02, 2009 3:57 am

Not sure where to put this, so...

At +499.45% item drops (according to Mafia anyway... 48-pound hound dog, among other things) Mother only dropped 9 alveoli.

I do remember reading that +items round down though, so maybe this confirms that?

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Post by salien » Thu Jul 02, 2009 4:48 pm

Well, since you get one alveolus for each full 50% bonus... that doesn't confirm anything about rounding, except that it doesn't always round up. It's less than 500%, so even with no rounding, you should've gotten 9 as you did. With round-nearest or round-down, you'd have 499%, so still 9 alveoli. Only round-up logic would've given you 10.

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Post by Fred Nefler » Thu Jul 02, 2009 6:35 pm

NotJim wrote:Not sure where to put this, so...

At +499.45% item drops (according to Mafia anyway... 48-pound hound dog, among other things) Mother only dropped 9 alveoli.

I do remember reading that +items round down though, so maybe this confirms that?
Are you perhaps Wallaby? Or were using a mayflower bouquet or box of fireworks? Each of these can randomly boost your effective +item%, and the first one won't even tell you when it does.

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Post by NotJim » Thu Jul 02, 2009 8:18 pm

salien wrote:Well, since you get one alveolus for each full 50% bonus... that doesn't confirm anything about rounding, except that it doesn't always round up. It's less than 500%, so even with no rounding, you should've gotten 9 as you did. With round-nearest or round-down, you'd have 499%, so still 9 alveoli. Only round-up logic would've given you 10.
I thought all +item modifiers were stored as integers, so only round-down.
Fred Nefler wrote:Are you perhaps Wallaby? Or were using a mayflower bouquet or box of fireworks? Each of these can randomly boost your effective +item%, and the first one won't even tell you when it does.
A maypole was equipped. Also, Blender... after helping to spade the hound dog under Wallaby, I know better now. >_>

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Post by salien » Mon Jul 06, 2009 9:04 pm

I'm still not sure what you're confused about; 9 is exactly the number of alveoli you should've gotten at +499.45% item drops, or for that matter, any item drop percentage from +450% to +499.999999999%.

From your use of the modifier "only" in "only dropped 9 alveoli": were you expecting 10? I can't see why you would expect to get more than 9, unless you thought item drop bonuses were explicitly rounded up.

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Post by Fred Nefler » Wed Jul 08, 2009 12:47 am

salien wrote:I'm still not sure what you're confused about; 9 is exactly the number of alveoli you should've gotten at +499.45% item drops, or for that matter, any item drop percentage from +450% to +499.999999999%.

From your use of the modifier "only" in "only dropped 9 alveoli": were you expecting 10? I can't see why you would expect to get more than 9, unless you thought item drop bonuses were explicitly rounded up.
I'd missed the part where he said 9. I figured he got 10 and was confused. But 9 is, in fact, exactly what you should get. The game always uses exact (up to computer limits) floating point calculations with meat and item drop bonuses. There is no rounding, ever.

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Post by NotJim » Wed Jul 08, 2009 3:25 am

Ok, looks like I'm completely wrong... thanks for correcting this noob >_>

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Post by Hellion » Mon Jul 13, 2009 2:12 pm

Fred Nefler wrote:The game always uses exact (up to computer limits) floating point calculations with meat and item drop bonuses. There is no rounding, ever.
I feel obliged to point out, however, that only the first 2 decimal places of your final item drop chance actually matter in most cases, as the game only rolls a (d10000 * 0.01) to compare against your drop chance.

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Fred Nefler
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Post by Fred Nefler » Mon Jul 13, 2009 2:48 pm

Hellion wrote:
Fred Nefler wrote:The game always uses exact (up to computer limits) floating point calculations with meat and item drop bonuses. There is no rounding, ever.
I feel obliged to point out, however, that only the first 2 decimal places of your final item drop chance actually matter in most cases, as the game only rolls a (d10000 * 0.01) to compare against your drop chance.
Huh, interesting. Thanks for mentioning that.

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