AFH Spading: Jack-in-the-Box (January 2010)

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Eleron
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AFH Spading: Jack-in-the-Box (January 2010)

Post by Eleron » Fri Jan 22, 2010 1:53 pm

Jack-in-the-Box spading by GoldS

What?
The jack-in-the-box is a familiar that was released when the Crimbo Tree activated. It's one of five items that can be obtained from the Crimbo Tree. As a gift item, it can't be bought from the mall or flea market, though it can be procured through gift packages and kBay.

How does it work?
The Jack-in-the-Box takes 3 combats to activate. Note that you must finish and win the combat to make the Jack-in-the-Box charge up -- running away won't do anything. The brass crank handle, its familiar equipment, is not required to charge it up. On the third combat, fully cranked, the Jack-in-the-Box will reveal its sinister contents, a grim visage of a clown's head swaying back and forth as though dancing to some horrific composition.

The Jack-in-the-Box has no effect on those turns it takes to charge up. The third turn, however, is where things get interesting.

What does it do?!
When the Jack-in-the-Box activates, it acts as a 2x Volleyball/Fairy. And by 2x, I don't mean 2x weight. I mean that it's a 2x power Volleyfairy. The bonus is multiplied, not the familiar weight.

For example, say the Jack-in-the-Box is 55 pounds. The item drop bonus for a 55 pound fairy is 107%, so the Jack-in-the-Box would have an item drop bonus of 214%. Likewise, a 49 pound Jack-in-the-Box would give 14 substat when it activates.

So what is it good for?
Well, I'm no speed ascender, so I can't really make a verdict on whether or not it's good in a run. What I can say is that it's excellent for getting Hobopolis / Mother Slime boss consumables. Just charge it up for two turns prior, then let it open up and rake in the drops.

For Hobopolis, be aware that you won't be able to defeat all 6 of the bosses with the Jack-in-the-Box if you're using the standard amount of +item buffs. For instance, cyclops eyedrops only lasts 10 turns, meaning that even if you charged up the Jack-in-the-Box before using the eyedrops, you could only fight 4 of the bosses before running out of the buff. With a Platinum Yendorian Express Card, you can extend your +item effects to be able to fight an extra boss, leaving 1 boss that you couldn't use the Box for. I'm guessing Zombo?

For Mother Slime there's really nothing to worry about, so hooray for that.

And I guess it has some use for when you're not farming.

Conclusion
Jack-in-the-Box acts as a 2x power, not weight, Volleyfairy every third combat you use it in. It only charges if you win the combat, so you can't use free runaways to charge it up.

Speed ascension relevant? I don't know. Aftercore relevant? Oh yes.

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Re: AFH Spading: Jack-in-the-Box (January 2010)

Post by desatysso » Fri Jan 22, 2010 2:43 pm

I'm sure we can come up with some decent uses for something that powerful. Thanks Eleron!
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Re: AFH Spading: Jack-in-the-Box (January 2010)

Post by Eleron » Fri Jan 22, 2010 3:49 pm

Thank GoldS :)

And yeah it's clearly optimal for ascension, but a lot of micromanagement for pretty minor gains, so might not be something worth bothering to do, just like the stocking.

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Re: AFH Spading: Jack-in-the-Box (January 2010)

Post by bumcheekcity » Fri Jan 22, 2010 4:48 pm

I HATE the micromanagement that this will (inevitably) bring.

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Re: AFH Spading: Jack-in-the-Box (January 2010)

Post by lordhades15 » Fri Jan 22, 2010 8:28 pm

I guess one of the immediate ideas that would come to mind is spending 2 turns in the junkyard and then 1 turn in the filthworms with 2x item drop. *shrugs* It's not wowing me, but I guess it has potential uses.
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Re: AFH Spading: Jack-in-the-Box (January 2010)

Post by NardoLoopa » Fri Jan 22, 2010 8:35 pm

The only problem with the 2 and 1 thinking is that you're spending +item buffs in an area you can't use them (the priming). While this isn't bad for things like the sticker sword, shugar shield, or phat loot (which you area probably running constantly anyway), and eyedrops, it is problematic for cyc-eyes, snowcones, !oObjectDet, VIP buffs etc.
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Re: AFH Spading: Jack-in-the-Box (January 2010)

Post by Eleron » Fri Jan 22, 2010 9:48 pm

Yeah, you probably don't want to do the switching while all-out cyclops etc. is running, for that you prepare-charge it for 2 turns at some point first, pop cyclops and such when you want items, use it for 1 turn, then switch to hound. Doing it for 1 turn like that is actually pretty cute and amusing :)

Or say screw it and don't bother, if you're not currently doing your fastest-run-ever =P

I might also probablymaybe use it for the sonars, since that doesn't last very long, and I don't spend big buffs there. Only if I'm on a speed run though ^^

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Re: AFH Spading: Jack-in-the-Box (January 2010)

Post by Kelemvor » Sat Jan 23, 2010 12:34 am

I'll probably try it out myself if nobody knows, but:

- if you spend two turns with it out, then pull out a different familiar, does it stay charged for when you switch back?
- if you use a runaway on turn 3, does that save the charge?
- what if you lose the combat on turn 3?

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Re: AFH Spading: Jack-in-the-Box (January 2010)

Post by GoldS » Sat Jan 23, 2010 1:13 pm

Kelemvor wrote:I'll probably try it out myself if nobody knows, but:

- if you spend two turns with it out, then pull out a different familiar, does it stay charged for when you switch back?
- if you use a runaway on turn 3, does that save the charge?
- what if you lose the combat on turn 3?

-Yes
-Yes
-Yes

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Re: AFH Spading: Jack-in-the-Box (January 2010)

Post by brb » Sat Jan 23, 2010 5:01 pm

This reminds me of the old queue and playing one turn in 3 different zones while switching familiars every time. I refuse to use it even though there has to be an optimal use somewhere. I hope they nerf the shit out of it so I don't get tempted to work it out. Too much micromanagement and runs are already long enough.

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Re: AFH Spading: Jack-in-the-Box (January 2010)

Post by Elayne » Mon Jan 25, 2010 6:59 am

While I agree that using this would be too micromanage-y, and would add tediousness and more RL time sunk to a run, I just can't reconcile that thought with the "No one's forcing anyone to use this so why nerf it" part. I know that it's like saying something stupid like "If you don't like the effort/difficulty/etc of a speed run then don't do it." *sigh* :cry:
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Re: AFH Spading: Jack-in-the-Box (January 2010)

Post by Kelemvor » Mon Jan 25, 2010 10:47 am

A couple more questions:
- Does the charge get reset at rollover?
- How about on ascension?

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Re: AFH Spading: Jack-in-the-Box (January 2010)

Post by p4n1q » Tue Jan 26, 2010 7:39 pm

Infernal seal fights also seem like a good way to add jack charges.

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Re: AFH Spading: Jack-in-the-Box (January 2010)

Post by p4n1q » Wed Feb 03, 2010 4:01 pm

Also, bricko monsters.

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Re: AFH Spading: Jack-in-the-Box (January 2010)

Post by lostcalpolydude » Wed Feb 03, 2010 11:23 pm

Bricko monsters cost you candy hearts or divine items. Other than the first one for a shield, I don't know if you would ever want to fight one in-run. And that early in the run, stats are important enough that you want a volley for that fight, or maybe a fairy if the shield drop rate is low enough. Based on my very limited knowledge of HC, at least.
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Re: AFH Spading: Jack-in-the-Box (January 2010)

Post by p4n1q » Wed Feb 03, 2010 11:27 pm

Yeah, I dunno if you'd want to do it in HC, but, for fighting six Hobo bosses in a row or something, though 0-turn fights could be good.

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