M:TG (split from Introductions)

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M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by thacon » Tue Apr 27, 2010 9:06 am

I was big into M:tG through the fourth edition. Then I took a year off and found that I couldn't get back into the game. They came out with way too many new abilities and expansions and I found that I had to read every card my opponent would play to figure out what was going on. I'm sure I wouldn't even recognize the game at this point.

Do people still play traditionally or has the online version taken off?

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Re: Introductions...

Post by maddsurgeon » Tue Apr 27, 2010 11:43 am

thacon wrote:I was big into M:tG through the fourth edition. Then I took a year off and found that I couldn't get back into the game. They came out with way too many new abilities and expansions and I found that I had to read every card my opponent would play to figure out what was going on. I'm sure I wouldn't even recognize the game at this point.

Do people still play traditionally or has the online version taken off?
I started playing again recently, mainly because the kids wanted to learn. It meant I had to dig out my old cards and read the new rules (they went through a big rules change about a year or two ago), but I think the changes are for the better and it's kind of fun.

I don't much care for playing casually, but I'll have to deal. There's no way I can afford to go back to buying cards by the booster box.
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Re: Introductions...

Post by Eigenbasis » Tue Apr 27, 2010 1:15 pm

thacon wrote:I was big into M:tG through the fourth edition. Then I took a year off and found that I couldn't get back into the game. They came out with way too many new abilities and expansions and I found that I had to read every card my opponent would play to figure out what was going on. I'm sure I wouldn't even recognize the game at this point.

Do people still play traditionally or has the online version taken off?
Both. Magic Online is still going strong and attendance at paper Magic tournaments is higher than ever.

I wouldn't mind if this was split into a new thread.
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Re: Introductions...

Post by lostcalpolydude » Tue Apr 27, 2010 1:24 pm

Eigenbasis wrote:I wouldn't mind if this was split into a new thread.
At first I remembered my last try at doing that, where loading 500 posts on 1 page basically froze my browser. Then I remembered that the updated forum software doesn't do that, so yay.
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Re: Introductions...

Post by demon llama » Tue Apr 27, 2010 1:26 pm

thacon wrote:I was big into M:tG through the fourth edition. Then I took a year off and found that I couldn't get back into the game. They came out with way too many new abilities and expansions and I found that I had to read every card my opponent would play to figure out what was going on. I'm sure I wouldn't even recognize the game at this point.

Do people still play traditionally or has the online version taken off?
I can understand the overwhelming nature of getting back into magic. I was a casual player and started with revised when I was in grade school and quickly lost interest when I was getting decimated by older people who had decks full of moxen and other restricted cards. I think I "quit" around 4th edition as well. When my best friend pestered me to try to get back into it when they released Kamigawa, I had a very tough time getting used to all the new cards, keywords and rule changes they introduced in the 10ish years of my haitus. I'd say the single most important thing is having a local play group without having to head into a store. Usually once or twice a week I get together with between 4 or 9 fellow players and we mix up the formats to play.

I've gone through many phases of favorite play styles: Vintage, multiplayer, limited formats, trying to play competitively etc. But one thing is certain for me: i can't stand the online version! Nothing will beat cardboard for me :).
I started playing again recently, mainly because the kids wanted to learn. It meant I had to dig out my old cards and read the new rules (they went through a big rules change about a year or two ago), but I think the changes are for the better and it's kind of fun.

I don't much care for playing casually, but I'll have to deal. There's no way I can afford to go back to buying cards by the booster box.
Keeping up to date on all the new cards (a new set gets released every 3 months or so!) can be prohibitively expensive. A lot of my fellow players have come to enjoy drafting cards from my collection of "greatest hits" (aka "The Cube"). You pre-select all your favorite cards, throw them into a box, shuffle it up, make some 15 card "packs" for everyone (the number of packs usually is 3, but increases with less then 8 players), draft, pick, make decks and fight in a small round robin tourney. Regather the cube together when everyone is done. Plenty of fun for a whole evening.

Another fun format is EDH (elder dragon highlander) which revolves around large 100 card decks which only allow single copies of cards related to the specific color(s) of a preselected general (a legendary creature). Since the games tend to go longer and the decks are rather inconsistent, the very powerful cards are relatively cheap in price since they don't see play in the competitive formats. I've participated in a few 4 player games that which took over 5 hours to finish. Ridiculous.

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by WiseFather » Tue Apr 27, 2010 1:26 pm

I have a huge box of the older sets.. not any of the first stuff but I have arabians, legendaries, dark, etc... I just don't have anyone to play with and like madd said.. just can't afford to get the cards by the box anymore.


Edit: not to mention it's been about 15 years since i last played.

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by slaphappy snark » Tue Apr 27, 2010 1:36 pm

Have any of you M:tG lovers tried Dominion? I really enjoy it, and I get the impression that it's an attempt to capture the fun of deck building without the archiving or keeping up with the Joneses--seems like it might appeal to someone like madd who's trying to play with the kids or a significant other?

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by Eigenbasis » Tue Apr 27, 2010 1:40 pm

WF, it may turn out that you have a lot of valuable cards lying there that weren't worth much back in the day that you could sell or trade for new cards if you pleased. Most "real" (black bordered) Arabian Nights cards are worth something. Mana Drain from Legends is over $100. Tabernacle at Pendrall Vale is over $200. Force of Will from Alliances is over $20 each.

As others have mentioned, the single thing that makes Magic most fun is having a good playgroup. Without one, it isn't worth playing, and with one it's a very entertaining hobby.

I've never heard of Dominion before, but it sounds interesting - sort of like what Richard Garfield intended Magic to be in the first place. He imagined people picking up a deck or two and playing it as a quick tabletop game between RPG sessions, not for people to seriously collect cards or to start a new genre of gaming.
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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by WiseFather » Tue Apr 27, 2010 2:28 pm

as with most things.. keep stuff around long enough and someone will want to buy it.. But it's my collection, i wouldn't sell it. I do need to go through it and catalog everything. I don't have a lot of arabians as I started collecting when they were going out. I focused on buying boxes of dark for a full set. Then any card I could get my hands on went into my box of cards. I know I have several dual lands. Those were fun to use and destroy. :)

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by maddsurgeon » Tue Apr 27, 2010 3:16 pm

slaphappy snark wrote:Have any of you M:tG lovers tried Dominion? I really enjoy it, and I get the impression that it's an attempt to capture the fun of deck building without the archiving or keeping up with the Joneses--seems like it might appeal to someone like madd who's trying to play with the kids or a significant other?
I haven't, but I've been meaning to. I have played Thunderstone, which I understand is quite similar. It was a lot of fun.

I do love the deck-building aspect of Magic most of all. My favorite way to play is booster draft - everybody buys three boosters of a particular set, throw in some land, draft and go (40-card decks). $12 a person, about the cost of a night at the bar, you have to make very interesting strategic choices, and you get to keep your stuff for later constructed play, if you feel like it.

I was kind of a card-game nut back when I had money to spend on such things. Back in the 90s there were a whole bunch of them, and I had decks for something like 20 different games. Doomtown, Vampire, and Legend of the Five Rings are my personal favorites. Sadly Doomtown is dead, but the other two are still being supported. The Steve Jackson games (Chez Geek, Munchkin) are pretty neat, too; simple and self-contained. The kids really like FLUXXX - we have the "Monty Python" version.
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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by p4n1q » Tue Apr 27, 2010 3:28 pm

I have probably played more M:TG on MWS than OTB.

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by Eigenbasis » Tue Apr 27, 2010 7:57 pm

I played MWS for a while until around when Conflux was released, and then it started crashing about 30 seconds into every game. I posted on forums and whatnot and got no response, and I haven't played since except to design decks. I might try downloading it again if I get bored with whatever I'm doing now.

As for paper magic, I play almost every week. Booster draft is my favorite, and I'm pretty good at it - and if we don't have enough packs to draft, we'll do a cube draft. The most popular constructed format in my playgroup is Legacy (I have a nearly optimized Goblins deck now), though EDH is popular too.
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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by Jaelith » Wed Apr 28, 2010 1:00 am

slaphappy snark wrote:Have any of you M:tG lovers tried Dominion? I really enjoy it, and I get the impression that it's an attempt to capture the fun of deck building without the archiving or keeping up with the Joneses--seems like it might appeal to someone like madd who's trying to play with the kids or a significant other?
My boyfriend and I play both Magic and Dominion. Dominion's fun, but a bit unfortunate in that 2-player play devolves almost immediately to the same game over and over regardless of the cards available. At the 2-player level, it seems to really lack the strategic options and same-game-but-different-game of Magic. On the other hand, 3+ player Dominion is definitely awesome for pick-ups that have the deck-building fun without the I DO NOT HAVE THE RIGHT CARDS anguish.

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by Mad Hamish » Wed Apr 28, 2010 7:44 am

slaphappy snark wrote:Have any of you M:tG lovers tried Dominion? I really enjoy it, and I get the impression that it's an attempt to capture the fun of deck building without the archiving or keeping up with the Joneses--seems like it might appeal to someone like madd who's trying to play with the kids or a significant other?
I play regularly at home with The Molehill and my friends and also online on BSW, and I fully intend to buy the new expansion as soon as it comes out. Which is tomorrow, I think.

Dominion rocks.
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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by Suendenbock » Wed Apr 28, 2010 8:13 pm

I play competitively but there are so many aspects of magic now that it doesn't matter on which level you wish to play. Whether it is EDH multiplayer, Two headed giant, booster drafts, sealed deck, play with the latest and newest cards (standard), or go all the way back to vintage. I love magic and don''t see myself stopping anytime soon. The rules changes that occured with M10 are very minor and don't affect the playability of the game, and like mentioned before magic attendance number both online and in real life are peaking and are breaking new records every year.

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by demon llama » Fri May 14, 2010 9:50 pm

Suendenbock wrote:I play competitively but there are so many aspects of magic now that it doesn't matter on which level you wish to play. Whether it is EDH multiplayer, Two headed giant, booster drafts, sealed deck, play with the latest and newest cards (standard), or go all the way back to vintage. I love magic and don''t see myself stopping anytime soon. The rules changes that occured with M10 are very minor and don't affect the playability of the game, and like mentioned before magic attendance number both online and in real life are peaking and are breaking new records every year.
I used to play competitively but the recent introduction of the mythic rarity has been really off-putting. Take a look at the cost of the newest competitive standard deck which takes advantage of the newest cards from rize of the eldrazi: blue white red planeswalkers. It costs around 600 bucks++! The bulk majority of the deck includes these mythic rares which are stupid powerful.

Now, I know magic is NOT a cheap hobby, but if I'm trying to compete in standard tourneys, the barrier to entry every 3 months is becoming way too high. This is even for a hobby I've stuck with for over a decade. This sucks.

Because of this, this past year has made me re-evaluate how I want to play the game with my local play-group. And yup--that means casual! EDH has quickly become my favorite format (on top of cube drafting from a proxied cube) because of all the wacky things that happen and the inconsistencies of the decks. Fun times.

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by Eigenbasis » Fri May 14, 2010 11:30 pm

More expensive than Ravnica standard, when 3 color decks were common and dual lands were $20-25 each?

Standard is, over time, the most expensive format (unless you're bad at Limited). I guess I'm lucky to live near one of the biggest hubs of competitive Legacy.
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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by Suendenbock » Mon May 17, 2010 9:35 am

Yeah eigen it is getting pretty absurd with the standard prices on cards. I am pretty fortunate to have access to lots of cards myself and an awesome play group of friends to help each other out. And i think mythic might be the most expensive deck in standard right now costing you about 800 dollars =P
If you want a cheap efficient deck play Devasting Red. But anyways GP Columbus is coming up anyone who loves Legacy better let me know and show up!

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by Eigenbasis » Mon May 17, 2010 11:28 am

As much as I love Legacy, I won't be able to make it.

What deck are you planning on playing?
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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by Suendenbock » Mon May 17, 2010 10:37 pm

Good Question =D

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by Eigenbasis » Tue May 18, 2010 12:21 am

Control makes up such a large part of the meta, so you want to either 1. be playing control 2. be playing a deck that beats control reliably or 3. play a combo deck that can win on turn 2 or 3. For 1, I like Bant builds that play Knight of the Reliquary or Natural Order/Progenitus, and the new UGr builds that play the new Jace planeswalker. For 2, Goblins usually mauls blue decks but has a tough time against combo; it's very matchup dependent. For 3, Ad Nauseum Tendrils or Reanimator with Show and Tell are probably best right now.
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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by thacon » Tue May 18, 2010 6:02 am

I had a deck that consisted of almost nothing but red lands, fireballs, lightnings, and forks. It wasn't very fun, but I could usually win competitions with it as long as my opponent wasn't using a white deck. (I think my Achilles heel was the circle of protection.) In that case, I also had a great white deck that consisted of one or two land summoned creatures and a bunch of army of allahs. My strategy was always speed.

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by vampirewolf3 » Fri May 28, 2010 6:21 pm

I play a lot at local tournaments, where some kid put together his own MTG-like game that I find fairly addicting in its own way.
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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by Mike Costa » Sat May 29, 2010 8:20 pm

If you're interested in Dominion, and/or you've heard of David Sirlin (Playing to Win), you might be interested in Puzzle Strike. The game's not out yet, but it should be available this summer, and he's taking pre-orders right now. Puzzle Strike is very similar to Dominion, with the whole deal of building your deck as you play. But you also have 10 different playable characters, and the different combinations of characters combined with the different combinations of starting chips/cards means that the game has over 400 million different starting conditions. So it's never the same! It's also much more balanced than Dominion, even with only 2 players.

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by Azaraek » Wed Jul 13, 2011 6:57 pm

I really enjoyed playing M:TG, but as I have gotten older it has been harder and harder to find people to play with. I know there are stores around that host Magic Tournaments, but I'm more of a "play at home while drinking Jaeger bombs" kinda guy.

It also became hard for me to play 3-4 years back when they started introducing tons of new abilities every set. I've never been the guy to blow a ton of money on one thing (Pokemon taught me that lesson back in the day), so I never had competitive decks. I would have a deck that I really liked, I would get pumped up, then a serious player would have rushed me and won by the 3-4 round.

All in all, extremely enjoy M:TG though.

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by williabr » Wed Jul 13, 2011 10:31 pm

slaphappy snark wrote:Have any of you M:tG lovers tried Dominion? I really enjoy it, and I get the impression that it's an attempt to capture the fun of deck building without the archiving or keeping up with the Joneses--seems like it might appeal to someone like madd who's trying to play with the kids or a significant other?
That looks cool. I'm in the same boat as Thacon. Played a ton until sometime around 4th, quit, and then was confused as hell when I tried to play again. The only times I've played since then have been fountain games instead of deck building.

This reminds me that I have a boat load of old cards at my mom's house that I need to unload.

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by slaphappy snark » Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:45 am

williabr wrote:
slaphappy snark wrote:Have any of you M:tG lovers tried Dominion? I really enjoy it, and I get the impression that it's an attempt to capture the fun of deck building without the archiving or keeping up with the Joneses--seems like it might appeal to someone like madd who's trying to play with the kids or a significant other?
That looks cool.
Let's play! Even stu will play Dominion sometimes. I think it's to placate me (okay, I know it is), but I will take it.

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by playultm8 » Thu Jul 14, 2011 10:51 am

I spent some time checking out dominion last night. I think I've figured out how to play. How to win is another matter....

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by quamper » Thu Jul 14, 2011 11:27 am

I love dominion! Intrigue and Seaside are my favorite expansions for it so far, I haven't played with Cornucopia yet though (I believe it just came out).

I actually have boxed copies of the game, but its honestly easier and quicker to play online on BSW.

As far as MTG goes, I don't have the time or money to sink into the actual ccg or the real online one, but I have a ton of fun playing Duels of the Planeswalkers on Steam http://store.steampowered.com/app/49470/ (its on playstation and xbox as well I guess) It's great since you don't have to buy packs or cards. It's sort of like magic lite and the price is pretty great.

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by williabr » Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:14 pm

slaphappy snark wrote:That looks cool.
Let's play! Even stu will play Dominion sometimes. I think it's to placate me (okay, I know it is), but I will take it.[/quote]

Sounds like we have the makings of a beer & game night!!

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by stupac2 » Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:23 pm

Blech. Can I just drink beer?

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by Borommakot_15 » Thu Jul 14, 2011 1:33 pm

thacon wrote:I had a deck that consisted of almost nothing but red lands, fireballs, lightnings, and forks.
I still run a green/red deck to this day.. Elf mana engine, with lots of X damage red spells, and a few utility cards.. I tend to win by turn 5 or get so screwed I'm dead by turn 7 or 8.
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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by Whym » Thu Jul 14, 2011 4:26 pm

quamper wrote:I love dominion! Intrigue and Seaside are my favorite expansions for it so far, I haven't played with Cornucopia yet though (I believe it just came out).

I actually have boxed copies of the game, but its honestly easier and quicker to play online on BSW.

As far as MTG goes, I don't have the time or money to sink into the actual ccg or the real online one, but I have a ton of fun playing Duels of the Planeswalkers on Steam http://store.steampowered.com/app/49470/ (its on playstation and xbox as well I guess) It's great since you don't have to buy packs or cards. It's sort of like magic lite and the price is pretty great.
I have the base game, and really enjoy it. Are the expansions worth getting if you only play once in a while? Man, threads like this make me wish I was back in the states so I could hang out with you all. :)

I have Duels '12 on my playstation. It's...ok. Like you said, it's Magic Lite, though, not as much as, say, the original Portal rule set. The fact that you can't choose which lands to tap irks me to no end.

I've been playing off and on since '95. Haven't had a decent playgroup since I moved two years ago, though. Now I just do the occasional online draft or play with my daughter. Still have my Sharuum EDH deck in a box somewhere.

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by quamper » Thu Jul 14, 2011 4:42 pm

Whym wrote:Are the expansions worth getting if you only play once in a while?

I have Duels '12 on my playstation. It's...ok. Like you said, it's Magic Lite, though, not as much as, say, the original Portal rule set. The fact that you can't choose which lands to tap irks me to no end.
Give the expansions a shot on BSW if you want to try them out and see what they are like. They aren't generally majorly game changing though the prosperity set can make things play strangely.

To be fair Duels 12 is a huge improvement over the last version of the game, the deck editing is so much better. And at least on the PC version there is properly chat capabilities at were lacking that the consoles had.

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by Draco Cracona » Fri Jul 15, 2011 8:37 am

Any suggestions for good deck boxes for sleeved EDH decks? I want to sleeve up my main EDH deck (Stonebrow), as it's getting some relatively expennsive stuffs in it (Top as a prime example), but if I do that, then I have nowhere to store it. Everywhere in the UK seems to be out of stock of http://www.magicmadhouse.co.uk/accessor ... -cards-p32, as was the last store I went to (there's nowhere that I know of in my current area). I'd like an actual box, as opposed to something like http://www.magicmadhouse.co.uk/accessor ... box-p35028 as from what I've seen of the latter they just come open.

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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by Eigenbasis » Fri Jul 15, 2011 8:48 am

I see a few options:

1. Those EDH deckboxes that are sold out

2. Those long deckboxes that carry multiple decks

3. Small cardboard boxes (which is what I use).

Speaking of EDH, I got the Devour for Power precon deck (BUG colors) and I'm loving the reanimator themes. I had a crazy game the other night - a 4 player game where someone else was playing reanimator, and he got a Mesmeric Orb out, so everyone had dozens of cards in their graveyard and we were reanimating everything in sight.

My other EDH deck is Captain Sisay, which is quite powerful, especially in 1v1.
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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by Whym » Fri Jul 15, 2011 5:26 pm

Draco Cracona wrote:Any suggestions for good deck boxes for sleeved EDH decks? I want to sleeve up my main EDH deck (Stonebrow), as it's getting some relatively expennsive stuffs in it (Top as a prime example), but if I do that, then I have nowhere to store it. Everywhere in the UK seems to be out of stock of http://www.magicmadhouse.co.uk/accessor ... -cards-p32, as was the last store I went to (there's nowhere that I know of in my current area). I'd like an actual box, as opposed to something like http://www.magicmadhouse.co.uk/accessor ... box-p35028 as from what I've seen of the latter they just come open.
I keep my EDH decks in a fat pack box.

TrueEeviL
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Re: M:TG (split from Introductions)

Post by TrueEeviL » Sat Jul 23, 2011 8:04 pm

Eigenbasis wrote:WF, it may turn out that you have a lot of valuable cards lying there that weren't worth much back in the day that you could sell or trade for new cards if you pleased. Most "real" (black bordered) Arabian Nights cards are worth something. Mana Drain from Legends is over $100. Tabernacle at Pendrall Vale is over $200. Force of Will from Alliances is over $20 each.
This is a year old, but even then Forces were $40, now good luck getting a set for $300. Legacy was awesome because it was a cheap alternative to Vintage (which is a WAY more fun format. Every deck can do dumb things sometimes, even without Power 9. I play Un-powered Oath and last time I played turn 1 o nthe draw was Fastbond->Lotus Petal->Vampiric->Gush->Gush->Time Vault->Voltaic Key->Misdirect their Force->Win). But now $100+ Duals and needing LED, Bob, Tarmo, Force, Jace or some combo there of prices me out of cool decks like NO RUG. I play Ichorid (LED-less most of the time since I only have 2) and The Gate which I'm about to sell (4 Bob, 2 Jitte, 1 Swords of L&S, 4 Thoughtseize, 3 Therapy) to finish TES. Once TES is actually done hopefully I can hit some SCG Opens.

Draft is ok, and Ive won a bunch, but doesn't really excite me. Snake-drafting (Lay the cards out, pick in order, then reverse order every round) is pretty awesome though. It should be done more, but it does take a while. I really dislike EDH and sold off the Kresh deck I had. I played Jund through both Alara standards (Yes, playing Jund in Alara-Zen was retarded before WW. I was probably ~30-10 at FNM, with 7 losses in the mirror, 1 Boss Naya and a two Speading Seas), but Scars is just icky as Caw-Blade proved. I don't even know if Extended even exists anymore because I've never even seen an extended deck.

I really get off on multiplayer, either FFA or Pentagram. Both of my main multiplayer decks are absolute monsters once the game gets to turn 4/5 which often ends up in 3-on-1 against most of my playgroups . If a deck exists that can out card advantage my Jund multiplayer, I'd pay to see it. I'm currently teachign multiplayer theory to some friends that started playing a few months back and it's pretty eye opening how players dont understand multiplayer is structured much differently than single. "Im going to duress you." "Wait, why the hell are you playing duress? This is a FFA game".

Yay, Magic!

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